Ishmael: Before we start the interview, just say your name, where are you from and your age to the microphone.

Alhaji: My name is AIhaji, I am from Africa, Sierra Leone.

Ishmael: How old are you?

Alhaji: I am 12 years old.

Ishmael: So Mr Alhaji, we are going to ask you to explain for us, like to tell us how was your life and your family before the war?

Ishmael: Look before the war, just tell us like for me, I was living an average life. We have every thing to make our life comfortable. My family and I were having family gathering, dinner, going to the beach etc. everything was fine, so I want you to explain to us the same thing about your own family.

Alhaji: When the war didn't came my family was doing good, we normally go out side and play. My friends and I were doing all kind of stuff and at night we will go to pray, but I don't pray a lot. My friends were Alusine and Alhassan.

Ishmael: OK, can you... you said that your family was doing good, can you be specific and dot them down.

Alhaji: Huh?

Ishmael: Like to be specific and dot them down. Like for me I told you that we was having fun by having family gathering, having dinner, and going out to the beach.

Alhaji: We don't have dinner. Everyone eat by themselves.

Aida-S: Why is that?

Alhaji: Huh?

Aida-S: Why is that?

Alhaji: I don't know. but me I used to eat with my family and sometimes I get into trouble , that why I eat by myself now.

Ishmael: OK let's keep going. can you please tell us what happen when the war comes to Sierra Leone or where you live.

Alhaji: When the war comes me and my family we went... we go to a lot of villages, we cross a lot of water and we went to Guinea. from Guinea, from Guinea...

Ishmael: Can you first explained what happen first in Sierra Leone, how long you and your family was in Sierra Leone before going to Guinea.

Alhaji: I don't know that one.

Ishmael: You don't know what happen before you travel to Guinea.

Alhaji: I don't know that one , you have to call my dad and ask him.

Aida-S: You don't know how old were you when the war started.

Alhaji: You gotta ask my dad all that. Yah could call my dad he is home right now.

Ishmael: We just need your perspective, we don't need your dad ‘s perspective.

Aida-S: Yeah.

Alhaji: Sorry but I don't know.

Ishmael: So just tell us what you remember when the war started in Sierra Leone or where you was living.

Alhaji: OK like I said when we was crossing the villages, when went to a lot of villages. The other time we went to a village a guy came and said that he is going to killed us if we did not give him a bike. We give him the bike and he went away. So we were lucky that he didn't killed us. Then we keep on going, we went to another village, we was there for a couple of months. We celebrated some holidays there and from there our uncle who was already here came to Guinea and send someone to go and get us there. From there we took a boot from Sierra Leone to Guinea. From Guinea now we was there for a year or two, then they started interviewing us about our families and from there we came here.

Ishmael: So when you guys were going from village to village, can you please be specific and explain to us what happen in this village to village. If like everything was fine, like for example for me I also travel from village to village. Like in some village we might go there we couldn't even find food to eat so we have to starve and go through out the day without food, slept on top of grasses in abandon building and stuff. So can you just be specific and tell us what happen from village to village.

Alhaji: Like the other village that we went first before we went to Guinea a lot of people treat us good, they even give us food and then place to stay. And then they give us a lot of things. me, my friend's family and some other families that we all came together they were staying in another house but we always play with each other. Then we came to Guinea, and then when we came to Guinea they went back to Freetown and I stay in Guinea so I don't have the chance to say good bye to them.

Ishmael: OK, so anything bad has never been happen to you guys when you was moving from one village to another.

Alhaji: No they never touch us.

Ishmael: So on the way like when you guys were... did you guys walk from village to village or you guys took a boat or a bus?

Alhaji: We walk from village to village and when we reach a river a little boy came he had a boat, we took the boat and went to another island.

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: Where?

Alhaji: Sierra Leone

Ishmael: Sierra Leone is the whole country.

Alhaji: No, no.

Ishmael: Where?

Alhaji: Makeni.

Ishmael: So you was living in Makeni. Makeni is actually a town in Sierra Leone and Freetown is the capital city. So Makeni is just a town.

Aida-S: OK!

Ishmael: So you was living in Makeni?

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So from Makeni you travel to where?

Alhaji: We travel to the villages.

Ishmael: Can you name some of the of the villages?

Alhaji: But I don't know the names.

Ishmael: So you don't know the names. OK, so when you guys moved from Makeni and go from village to village nothing bad happens to you guys on the way?

Alhaji: No, we never get that because we took some food with us.

Ishmael: OK.

Alhaji: And then when we came here back like in 2001 I don't remember then my grand father died, my mom's father and my uncle also died my mom's brother.

Ishmael: But they died here or in the war?

Alhaji: No is not in the war, they died when the war is already finish. When they are trying to get them out.

Ishmael: So you guys walk until you reach the border between Sierra Leone and Guinea, right.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So how long you guys were in Guinea for?

Alhaji: Like a year, I don't remember.

Ishmael: Like a year.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: Can you explain to us how life was for you and your family during this time when you and your family were in Guinea?

Alhaji: When we was in Guinea we was doing good because my uncle was there, my brother was there, my bigger brother, my other uncle was there, my cousin was there. Everybody was there so we were living good. And we also rent a house there so we can stay in.

Ishmael: OK, so you mean because your uncle, your aunt, your brother and everybody was there so everything was good.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: Can you just be specific why life was good. Because I know sometimes even though your family is around you life is not always good. Especially when you are in a country that is not yours. Like I was in Guinea...

Alhaji: Like when we get there we make a lot of friends. We get a lot of new people, like a guy that has a store next to we and another guy that has a store next to we they sell like shoes So I always stay with them and play with them and I also hang out with them.

Ishmael: So food was fine.

Alhaji: Yeah and I always hang out with them.

Ishmael: OK, so nobody like... because I know in Guinea if they hear you speak Krio they [the Guineans] will take you to the prison, take your money from you or beat you up. So did you and your family ever have those kind of discriminations when you were in Guinea.

Alhaji: When we first get there that does not happen to us, but long, long time after time past, time past. The kids that are in school started to fight with cops. So at that time we the kids doesn't come outside and the grown-ups stay inside too.

Ishmael: Which of the kids were fighting with the cops the Guinea kids or the Sierra Leone kids?

Alhaji: No the Guinea kids.

Ishmael: They were fighting with the cops.

Alhaji: Yeah in Guinea.

Ishmael: Why were they fighting with the cops?

Alhaji: I don't know. like when we was looking at the news at night we saw them fighting each other. They were throwing stones, shutting and stuff like that. But that does not come near to us, like we was here and the airport was here [close to each other]. So we was right next to the middle of the street. Like when the kids come they pass through our building and go down.

Ishmael: OK.

Alhaji: So nothing bad has happen to us.

Ishmael: So in Guinea everything else was fine.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: You guys were lucky. I went through a lot of discrimination in Guinea. Then I remember one time when the rebels were attacking the borders of Guinea and the Guineans were going house to house to look for Sierra Leoneans. They were saying that we want to bring war in their country. They will ask Sierra Leoneans to leave their houses in the morning and spend the whole day in the chief's house sitting under thr sun. Did that happen to you guys?

Alhaji: No that did not happen to us.

Aida-S: When you was in Guinea was you in school?

Alhaji: No, I was not in school. Because the language that they speak in school I don't know how to speak it. So that why I did not get to school.

Aida-S: So you live in the house? How did you find that house when you came from Sierra Leone to Guinea?

Alhaji: We were in a village next to Guinea and our uncle who was already here came to Guinea and send someone to get us in that village so that we could come to Guinea.

Ishmael: So how many years did you lost school for?

Alhaji: I don't know.

Ishmael: You don't know.

Alhaji: No, but when I get here I started picking up some things until now I get it.

Ishmael: When did you actually leave Makeni? What year?

Alhaji: I don't know what year.

Ishmael: You don't know what year.

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: OK, so in Guinea everything was fine, your uncle who was living here went over there and send someone to go get you guys. So when the person get you guys, did you guys went to Conakry or to the camp?

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: You guys went to Conakry.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: And from Conakry your uncle who was already here, he rent a house for you guys, then you guys were living in the house.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So when you guys were already in Conakry, your uncle who was already here stay with you guys or he left back for the United States.

Alhaji: He was with us for a couple of months then he left and came back to the United States but he going back to Guinea to see us.

Alhaji: Yeah, from here he keep on going there.

Ishmael: So he was going back and forth.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So everything was fine in Guinea. So when you was like... OK let me ask you this question, when you was leaving your house in Makeni, the house that you was born and raise and the war came. You have to leave your house and everything, you was just going from village to village. At that moment how was you like feeling, when you was walking from village to village.

Alhaji: When we was walking from village to village?

Ishmael: Yeah.

Alhaji: I don't know how I was feeling.

Ishmael: You was not having any emotions.

Alhaji: I was not feeling anything, I wasn't crying. I was just to tired. Because when you walk a lot you get too tired. So I was just too tired.

Ishmael: You was not having any emotions like feeling sad, bad. That now you leaving your house and your friends...

Alhaji: I was walking with two of my best friends. Only some of my friends were staying there.

Ishmael: So you doesn't missed your house.

Alhaji: Unh-uh.

Ishmael You don't missed your house. Like the house that you was staying.

Alhaji: I missed it.

Ishmael: So at that moment that you was leaving the house because you was not planning to come back or you don't know if the rebels were going to burnt the house or something. I was you like feeling at that moment that you was leaving this house that you have live all your life.

Alhaji: I was feeling bad because I thought that am not gonna go there back. And when we went to another village, we made a lot of stuff, that me and my friends made and we want to go there back so we could make it there. But I never had the chance to go there back. So from Guinea I just came here I never had the chance to go back to Sierra Leone.

Ishmael: So you said you was feeling bad, can you just be specific and tell us what kind of bad you was feeling?

Alhaji: About the house I don't know what will happen to it.

Ishmael: OK, so in this case you are telling us that you was feeling bad because you left your house but at the same time you was feeling good because you was with you best friends and family.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So then you left your house and went to Guinea, in Guinea you was still with you friends or you guys separated?

Alhaji: I was still with them but later we get separated, they went back to Sierra Leone and I stay in Guinea.

Alhaji: Yeah and I stay in Guinea.

Ishmael: When you guys... so after the interview you guys came, did all of your family came here at the same time or some has to stay behind?

Alhaji: Yeah, some had to stay behind like my older brother. He didn't came.

Ishmael: He is still there in Conakry.

Alhaji: No, [ shakes his head] he went back to Sierra Leone.

Alhaji: No he went back to Freetown.

Ishmael: OK, now here in New York, how does it to you the day that you guys were leaving for the United States? Like you will be like today am going inside a plane fly to America, the wonderful states that everybody want to see and come to. How was like feeling at that moment.

Alhaji: I did not feel anything.

Ishmael: No, you do feel something.

Alhaji: I was just medium and my mouth was medium too. I was not feeling anything. I was not feeling sad or either happy,

Ishmael: You was not even feeling something for the fact that you know you are going to America and seeing the plane in front of you?

Alhaji: I was just happy because, maybe am going to met new friends. That's all I feel, but I did not feel happy to go in the plane.

Aida-S: Were you sad because you was leaving Guinea.

Alhaji: Umm, Guinea. I did not even live there for a long time.

Aida-S: OK, so you came here from the village near to Guinea.

Alhaji: We went from the village to Guinea and from Guinea to here New York city. And when we came to New York city my aunty, my uncle went and pick us up in the airport.

Ishmael: OK, let me share this. Maybe if I share this maybe you might have and idea of what kind of answer we want from you. When I was like... October 16 actually, when October 15 comes I was like oh am going to America tomorrow. You know the whole night I didn't sleep, I was just thinking. I was like now am going to America am going to lose my friends, I have traveled from Sierra Leone to Guinea and here [in Guinea] I have settle because I had a lot of friends now even though is not my country and now am leaving to start life all over again in another country. I was a little sad like 20% but I was 80% happy because I have the privilege to see this wonderful America that everybody wanted to go to but they do not have the privilege. So I feel lucky and bless. Even some of my friends were like when you get there please do not forget us please been calling us. I know you was feeling excited and great, don't you?

Alhaji: I was not feeling excited, I was just feeling like am gonna missed my friends. But I did not feel happy that am coming here. Because I know am going to missed my friends back there, although I know am going to make new friends here but am going to missed the first ones that I had ever made in my life.

Ishmael: So in this case you telling us that you was like feeling bad because you are going to missed you friends...

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: But you did not feel any good or excitement of coming to the United States.

Alhaji: No, [shakes his head] like I was jumping around to come here, no. I did not jump around I was just missing my friends because they are the first two friends that I have ever made in my life I hadn't make any friends in my life. And my other friends which are my neighbor.

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: No, so what were your expectations when your uncle told you that you are coming to America? What were you expecting to see?

Alhaji: Umm, like when we first went to Guinea, he went and give us some drinks and from there we went to the house. But he did not tell us that we are coming to America. I did not know that we are coming to America. Until when we went to the house and after some days past, then he told us that we are coming to America. Both of my parents did not tell me until they find out, they told me and started taking me for interview and I don't know what the interview is going to be about.

Ishmael: Do you know if your uncle filed for you guys through the IRC [International Rescue Committee.]

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: Which agency?

Alhaji: I don't know.

Ishmael: Maybe is the IRC.

Alhaji: That why I said I didn't know what was going on. The time that I find out was the time we was going for interview and we come here.

Ishmael: What was you expecting when you came here? Like for me I was expecting to finish school in one year because people were like they promote school kids to new grades every month. Then am going to have a lot of money, get my own house with everything inside of it that could make me comfortable and my own car. So what were you own expectations?

Alhaji: Nothing. When I came here then I start watching cartoon and I start liking them and I also met a new friend that makes me start watching cartoons. The first cartoon that I start watching was "magic school bus". Then I start watching war cartoons that they show fighting and stuff.

Ishmael: So you was not having any expectations at all.

Alhaji: Me?

Ishmael: Yeah.

Alhaji: No.

Aida-S: So before you came here did you think like, oh god how is my life gonna be there?

Alhaji: Yeah I think about stuff like that.

Ishmael: So we went you to share with us and be specific what was you thinking about, what were you expectation?

Alhaji: I was just thinking if am gonna be here if I will able to make new friends, and if everybody is going to like me. That was the only thing I was thinking about, I was not thinking about anything else.

Ishmael: So what you are trying to tell us here is that in your own life friendship is the most important thing.

Aida-S: Yeah.

Alhaji: Yeah, because if you don't have a friend you will never live good.

Ishmael: No, that's not true. Sometimes it is true but sometimes it is not true. You know friends do betray you some times.

Alhaji: Friends?

Ishmael: Yeah friends, sometimes they pretend as if as they like you but they don't. So what you are telling us here is everything for you is about friends. Alhaji: No, like when I first came here the ones that I met we didn't be friends for long and I stop following them and I met new friends. Now the friends that I met were the ones that I play with and walk with. It's three of us.

Ishmael: So you was not expecting anything just to make new friends?

Alhaji: No that was not the only thing, I was also expecting to met my uncle.

Ishmael: OK, expecting to met your uncle, expecting to make new friends etc that's it.

Alhaji: No, and also expecting to go to school.

Ishmael: And also expecting to start school.

Aida-S: So how did you emerge the school?

Alhaji: When I first start going to school?

Aida-S: No, before you came here. You didn't know how the school here works. So what did you think the school is like?

Alhaji: I think the schools will be like... like when I was back home they used to say that if even you fail your tests they will let you go to the next class. Then when I came here they change it and put it in a different way now. That if you fail your classes you go to summer school but if you did not fail you do not have to go to summer school.

Ishmael: So what you are like trying to tell us is, when you was in Guinea people usually tell you that if even you fail a class the teachers will ask you to go to the next class.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: That how you was imagine the school.

Alhaji:Yeah.

Ishmael: So when you came to New York city, did your imagination come true, did everything work out well, did you make friends, did you like the school system in New York city.

Alhaji: Yeah, but when I first came here the kids at school were teasing me and I start getting over it, that if they tease me am gonna be mad at them and the other time when they tried to tease me I follow them and they never tease me again. And I made a lot of friends when I was in my classroom.

Ishmael: How was these kids teasing you, what were they saying to you to tease you?

Alhaji: They said am from Jamaica, but am not.

Alhaji: They said I am from Jamaica, but I am not.

Ishmael: OK, they said you are Jamaican and African?

Alhaji: No they never said I am from Africa, they only said that I am from Jamaica.

Ishmael: So they were actually saying that you was from Jamaica but you are not really from Jamaica, but you are from Africa.

Aida-S: So they didn't believe you when you said you are from Africa.

Alhaji: Some of them did, but some of them did not. Like most teachers believe me. Teachers always believe me.

Ishmael: Why do they think that you are from Africa?

Alhaji: Maybe is the way I talk, because when I first came here I talk like Jamaicans. But when I start getting used to it then I start speaking.

Ishmael: So how did you learn English, because you speak perfectly than me. Like when I first came here to learn English I read a lot of books, watch cartoons etc...

Alhaji: I didn't read books. Because when I was home I used to watch cartoons and my cousin that was born here when I went to talk to him I talk in English.

Ishmael: So you normally watch cartoon when you was back home, in Makeni or in Guinea.

Alhaji: No I didn't watch cartoons there, I was just playing I watch movies. But I didn't watch cartoons.

Ishmael: where in Guinea?

Alhaji: Yeah, in Guinea. But when I came here now I started watching cartoons.

Ishmael: So you start learning English by watching cartoon or how did you learn English?

Alhaji: I learn English by talking to everybody in English, like when they say something I don't look at it in the dictionary. I just keep thinking about it. How they speak is how am gonna used it.

Ishmael: So what you are trying to say is that, whenever you hear somebody say something you pick it up and start saying it back.

Alhaji: Like when somebody say something I start saying it, but if it is a curse I will not say it.

Ishmael: Your father, mother and brother is here.

Alhaji Yeah. And my sisters. Only one of my brother is back home.

Ishmael: So how old is your brother who is here?

Alhaji: My other brother is 13 and my sister is 12.

Ishmael: Your brother who is going to Bronx international is 13?

Alhaji: Osman?

Ishmael: Yeah.

Alhaji: I don't know. He is not 13.

Ishmael: How old is he?

Alhaji: I don't know. He doesn't tell me.

Ishmael: You didn't ask him?

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael So can you share with us some of the things that work out well and some of the things that doesn't work out for you since you came to New York City?

Alhaji: Umm, some of the things that work out good was I always play with my friends, we always go and play soccer. Like my other cousin that we all came always take me for soccer practice and my other cousin that was already here we always talk English. They always take me to soccer practice, like where they play soccer and games they always take me there.

Ishmael: So in this case you are telling us that things were fine because you was having fun with your friends and family by taking you for soccer practices. So what were the things that doesn't work for you here in New York City?

Alhaji: The things that doesn't work for me is when they say bad words to me.

Ishmael: You get mad.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: And what else?

Alhaji: And when they wonna fight me.

Aida-S: What kind of bad words?

Alhaji: You know the "F" word to me. They always say that word.

Ishmael: Oh, the "F" word. [Laughing] And what else?

Alhaji: That was the bad word that I get mad of.

Ishmael: But you never say that word to anybody?

Alhaji: I say it to some people.

Ishmael: But you don't want people to say it back to you.

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: Then why you didn't like it?

Alhaji: If they say it to me I say it back.

Ishmael: What you are saying here is you never say it to somebody who doesn't say it to you.

Alhaji: Like if they say it to me I just say forget you and I go somewhere. If my friends are not around I just go and take my game and start playing.

Ishmael: So when you guys came here your father has a job your mother has a job and everything in the home is fine. so the only thing that was bad was the "F" word at school.

Aida-S: How about trains, subway was it hard for you?

Alhaji: I used to go under the turnstile, but one time now they told me not to go under any more. Because when I first came here I was short. So I stop and I started to using the token now.

Ishmael: So you never used metro card, you just go under the turnstile and get in to the trains.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: So how did you find it to used the trains, excited, boring or sad.

Alhaji: How?

Ishmael: Like how did you find it to use the trains?

Alhaji: Cool.

Ishmael: Cool? OK.

Aida-S: So you never get lost on the train?

Alhaji: No, I never get lost because am always walking with some one.

Ishmael: OK. When I came here because we do not have trains back home, I find it excited to ride the trains and one I get lost. It was terrible because I was by myself.

Alhaji: When I was in Guinea I always see trains pass by on the railroad so that why I never worrying about it a lot.

Ishmael: So can you share with us your plans for the future?

Alhaji: I don't know what the future is gonna be.

Ishmael: What are your predictions, like what do you think the future is going to be for you or what do you want to be in the future.

Alhaji: Nothing.

Ishmael: Nothing?

Alhaji: The only thing that I want to be when I grow-up, is I want to be a soccer player and basketball player.

Ishmael: That's your plan you want to be a soccer player or a basketball player.

Alhaji: Yeah.

Ishmael: This one is gonna be hard for you but am gonna still ask you. do you have any concerns or worried about anything in New York City?

Alhaji: Me?

Ishmael: Yeah. you are not worried about kid taking drugs, people dying of HIV. Are not worried about stuff like that?

Alhaji: I don't take those stuff.

Ishmael: I am not talking about you, but other teenagers out there in New York City.

Alhaji: I don't know about them so that why am not worrying about them.

Ishmael: So you don't worry about them?

Alhaji: I don't know if they are taking it or not.

Ishmael: But you watch TV, you hear the news that kids are taking drugs and people are dying of HIV.

Alhaji: I don't watch the new, my dad watch the news.

Ishmael: If even you don't watch the news ,you might hear it from your friends at school.

Alhaji: They don't talk about that, we talk about different thing.

Ishmael: OK, so do you want to ask us anything or send a message to president Bush.

Alhaji: No.

Ishmael: No?

Aida-S: Where would you like to like in the future, here or in Africa?

Alhaji: I wanna stay here until when I finish high school or college and go back Sierra Leone.

Aida-S: Yeah.

Alhaji: We finish?

Ishmael: Yeah.

Aida-S: Thank you.

Ishmael: Thank you so much.